Lab thinks he's starving!

kelleyanne1988 · Post by **kelleyanne1988** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 5:29 pm

Alrighty.... Gunner is a pig I swear! (And yet I can still see his ribs!) I know most labs are VERY food motivated... But he is almost TOO food motivated (if you can get that way). Whenever he sees food he doesn't know anything anymore... He doesn't know his name, doesn't know the word "no" or anything! A co-worker of mine free feeds her puppy (which I've started to notice that at 16weeks is starting to look a lil overweight), when I take Gunner over there for puppy playdates, he knows where Holli's food is and goes straight for it! (Why my co-worker doesn't pick it up before I get there I'm not sure!) So I have to walk over there (after he's spilt some of the food on her kitchen floor cuz she has plastic bowls) and pick up the food, he wont leave the kitchen area until he knows that there is NO more food on the floor what so ever! and only THEN will he begin to play with Holli.

Also, when I put food down (even making him sit before hand) he breathes in his food like he hasn't been fed in days! I'm wondering what yall's view on how to get him to slow down would be? (He doesnt the same thing on his water at times, he has a pretty good size water bowl and he empty's it almost twice a day.)

DogzRule1996 · Post by **DogzRule1996** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 5:59 pm

People say that Kongs are good. You put the food in them and give it to your dog. It stimulates their mind as well as slows them down while eating because they have to learn HOW to get their food first BEFORE actually being able to eat.

kelleyanne1988 · Post by **kelleyanne1988** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:18 pm

He has a kong... but his food would just fall out of that VERY easy, and he would make a mess out of it, and i would have to fill it a couple times for him to get all his meal taken care of... So... Any way to slow it down where he's still eatin out of his bowl? I dont know if I should just give him a lil bit at a time in his bowl (i could do that, at least then he wouldnt be making a mess), but i need him to learn to eat slower when it's all there... how do i go about that?

springermomx3 · Post by **springermomx3** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:42 pm

If you want him to slow down eating put a big rock in his bowl. He will have to eat around it. They also sell bowls that slow down his eating.

Also dont put just kibble in the kong. Maybe put some peanut butter mixed with kibble in there. Will make it harder for him to get out.

springermomx3 · Post by **springermomx3** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:43 pm

Also make sure whatever you are feeding him has a higher protein level. Not sure what he eats but if theres too many empty carbs he will feel hungry. He needs meat.

kelleyanne1988 · Post by **kelleyanne1988** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:51 pm

I did change his food from what the breeder fed him (had like corn something or another as it's main ingredient), to purina one puppy (has chicken or lamb as it's main ingredient). I've talked to the vet and they say he's at a fine weight (I was worried about him being under weight cuz i can see his ribs - like can count them at times), they said i could up his feed about 1/4 cup in the morning or evening feeding or both if I wished (he was at 1cup two times a day when they told me this - this was about a month ago). I still havent seen much a difference.

I was wondering what is so different between a puppy food, and a puppy - large breed food? Since it's a lab is it critical that he eats a puppy - large breed food? Because I was going to switch him over if need be, was wondering if that would help with his eating habits and his weight.

maximoo · Post by **maximoo** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:25 pm

Any food made by purina is low quality. Please reconsider and give him a better quality food. read the DIET threads--there's tons of suggestions & information. Also you can freeze the Kong with whatever you put it in. They more or less have to lick it out.
There are bowls shaped sorta like a bundt cake pan with a big hump in the middle which allegedly slows down eating. They have them at the pet stores. Or, like previously suggested put a few rocks in bowl so he has to eat around them slowing him down. Hand feeding and making him sit for every handful will begin to teach self control.
Good luck with your little piglet!

kelleyanne1988 · Post by **kelleyanne1988** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:54 pm

I've looked into other foods, but I have to consider what I can afford. Being a college student, I can't afford to have a extremely high quality food mailed to my door step. And the fact that I live in the middle of nowhere pretty much, it's hard for me to find a place that sells a high quality dog food. So I am trying to get the best food I can from the grocery store. So far Purina is the one I've noticed the most that has a meat as it's main ingredient.

If you wouldn't mind... I've read in a few threads that Purina isn't a good food... Why exactly is that? I'm going to put what the bag says it has so maybe I'll understand a bit better as to why it's so bad for a dog? And... is it that horrible to feed it to my dog? Or just not as good of quality as I could get?

Lamb, brewers rice, corn gluten meal, oat meal, fish meal (source of DHA), whole grain corn, animal fat preserved with mixed-tocopherols (form of Vitamin E), poultry by-product meal, animal digest, calcium phosphate, potassium chloride, salt, caramel color, calcium carbonate, choline chloride, L-Lysine monohydrochloride, zinc sulfate, Vitamin E supplement, ferrous sulfate, manganese sulfate, niacin, Vitamin A supplement, calcium pantothenate, thiamine mononitrate, copper sulfate, riboflavin supplement, Vitamin B-12 supplement, pyridoxine hydrochloride, garlic oil, folic acid, Vitamin D-3 supplement, calcium iodate, biotin, menadione sodium bisulfite complex (source of Vitamin K activity), sodium selenite.

Crude Protein (MIN) 28.0% Phosphorus (P) (MIN) 0.8%
Crude Fat (MIN) 16.0% Selenium (Se) (MIN) 0.30 mg/kg
Crude Fiber (MAX) 3.0% Vitamin A (MIN) 13,000 IU/kg
Moisture (MAX) 12.0% Vitamin E (MIN) 100 IU/kg
Linoleic Acid (MIN) 1.4%
Docosahexaenoic Acid (DHA) (MIN)* 0.05%
Calcium (Ca) (MIN) 1.0%

Also, what should I be looking for in dog food when I'm picking it out? So that way I can get the best food for what's around me. Also, should he be on a puppy large breed formula? Or does it matter if it's large breed formula or not? If that does matter... what's the difference in a large breed formula and a regular puppy formula?

maximoo · Post by **maximoo** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 9:38 pm

These ingredients are not good: corn gluten meal, whole grain corn, poultry by product meal, and animal digest.

The corn is nothing but a filler--it fills dog w/o providing much nutrition. Makes dog poop alot.
The poultry by products can include beaks feather and talons

Animal digest just sounds disgusting! Sounds like animal feces to me!

I understand your financial situation but think about this: You will feed less of a high quality food and provide better nutrition. I buy Blue Buffalo at Petsmart a 32 lb bag last 2 1/2 to 3 mths and costs around $40. That is less than $20 a mth. Most high quality foods will cost around this price, some may be a bit higher. Once you decided on a food you can usually go on their website & request a coupon or maybe a sample.

As far as your logistics, I'm sure you get to town every now & then or perhaps some friends/family come to visit. Can anybody get to a petsmart, petco, or maybe costco. I heard Diamond is a decent food, and they make Kirkland sold only at costco. I think price wise they are probably cheaper but offer satisfactory nutrition.

Keep reading the DIET threads. You will make a good choice for your bundle of joy!

kelleyanne1988 · Post by **kelleyanne1988** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 1:30 am

Well I'm in a town, but it's VERY small... the closest petsmart is an hour drive. There's not a petco either nor a costco. That's why I'm really trying my hardest to get the best I can for what's available in a grocery store. There are 2 or 3 pet stores around me, but none of which sell pet food for some reason.

springermomx3 · Post by **springermomx3** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 5:36 am

What city/town do you live in? I can find foods in your area for you if you want.

There are plenty of foods out there that dont cost an arm and a leg and are still good quality. And also when they eat a better food they eat less, so you are buying less.

Brewers Rice - A processed rice product that is missing many of the nutrients contained in whole ground rice and brown rice. Contrary to what many pet food companies want to make you believe, this is not a high quality ingredient, just much cheaper than whole grain rice.

Corn Gluten Meal - An inexpensive by-product of human food processing which offers very little nutritional value and serves mainly to bind food together. It is not a harmful ingredient but should be avoided simply for its poor nutritional value and quality.

Animal Digest - A cooked-down broth made from unspecified parts of unspecified animals. The animals used can be obtained from any source, so there is no control over quality or contamination. Any kind of animal can be included: "4-D animals" (dead, diseased, disabled, or dying prior to slaughter), goats, pigs, horses, rats, misc. roadkill, animals euthanized at shelters, restaurant and supermarket refuse and so on.

Animal Fat - Note that the animal source is not specified and is not required to originate from "slaughtered" animals. The rendered animals can be obtained from any source, so there is no control over quality or contamination. Any kind of animal can be included: "4-D animals" (dead, diseased, disabled, or dying prior to slaughter), goats, pigs, horses, rats, misc. roadkill, animals euthanized at shelters, restaurant and supermarket refuse and so on.

Menadione - Unnecessary ingredient in dog food. This synthetic version of vitamin K has not been specifically approved for long term use, such as in pet food. It has been linked to many serious health issues

springermomx3 · Post by **springermomx3** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 5:37 am

Also wanted to add that, because the first ingredient is lamb and not lamb meal (water removed), the first ingredient really ISNT lamb... its more the rice and corn gluten, then maybe lamb.

Noobs · Post by **Noobs** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:06 am

My dog went from Purina Dog Chow (at the shelter) to Eukaneuba and finally a skin rash made it necessary to switch him to Natural Balance Potato and Duck that I get from a holistic pet store that is farther than the Petland but worth the trip. And I have to walk there with one of those granny carts to bring the 30-lb bag home!

I soak the dry kibble for an hour in water that I save left over from when I boil broccoli (this nifty trick I got from the nice folks on this forum) and then add canned Natural Balance Duck and Potato and mix it up. He eats less food now, his skin cleared up, I haven't had to take him to the vet since the rash cleared up (I used to have to take him every few weeks for any number of reasons), his coat is really shiny and he doesn't scratch nearly as much. So a better quality food is well worth it even if you think it costs more. Your dog will end up needing less food so it's cost-effective.

As for the kongs, if you invest in a couple of them, you could probably feed the meals out of it - and if you soak the kibble first then put it in the kong, seal the top with a little peanut butter then freeze it, it will take longer and the kibble won't fall out because it's soft from being soaked.

Springermom and maximoo have provided good info, I just wanted to add my personal experience as well.

Noobs · Post by **Noobs** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:09 am

And another suggestion: when you have playdates, I think that if you say something like, "Could you put Holli's food somewhere out of reach before we get there? Gunner's kind of greedy and I don't want him to steal Holli's food" then it'll be non-confrontational. It probably doesn't occur to your co-worker to pick up the food anyway so nudge her in that direction.

Cracker · Post by **Cracker** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:34 am

Lots of good info. Remember that ingredient lists on dog food are NOT legally enforced to be in order of quantity. On human food yes, but on dog food, labelling is iffy.

I started out on Purina too. I had a hard time justifying the cost. Then I did some research and the Wellness food I have her on now actually costs less over time because she eats less of it.

Are you rural? Some "feed stores" carry better foods..check around.

As for skinnypuppy..well, Cracker looked like a bone rack off and on for almost a year..growth periods mostly..she eventually settled into a good body weight.

Large breed puppy food IS important. It is specially formulated to have the right amounts of fat/protein/carbs to ensure a slow rate of growth, which is easier on their bones and joints. Proper nutrition in the first year or so of a dogs life keeps them in good stead for life.

I also have to remind my friends to take up their dog's food when I come over for visits...and Cracker's an adult dog! She's EXTREMELY food motivated which is a BOON for training but self control is NOT her middle name..lol. She will leave it if I tell her to, but it's much easier not giving her the tempation in the first place.

Remember not to fall for the "but MOM I"M STARVING" ploy. Some dogs will eat until they bloat or vomit.