Animal Heroes

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JudyN
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Animal Heroes

Post by JudyN »

I watched a TV programme called 'Animal Heroes' last night, which was a behind-the-scenes look at the royal Army Veterinary Corps. What fascinated me was the dogs trained to attack and bite another person. The narrator kept stressing that these dogs were trained to be aggressive, and they certainly did look the part, throwing themselves at the kennel gates, lips curled and teeth on show, or straining at their leash barking at the 'enemy' their handler is yelling at and trying to apprehend. They seemed to be very pumped up and when in a group, had to be kept 5m away from any other dog, and any person other than their handler.

But can they be really aggressive? How come they never (or rarely) attack their handler if they don't want to do what the handler asks? If they are likely to attack another dog, how can they focus on their work in a group? How come they never redirect onto the handler? I also wondered just how severe their bite would be - in training they grab hold of a padded arm, but would their teeth sink into the flesh, or do they just hold on? And what if they decided to rip the victim's face off instead? And despite being so pumped up, once they have the victim in their grasp, their handler can easily remove them and get them back under control. I really should watch it again and pay close attention to the dogs' body language.

We didn't see the training of these dogs - the programme focused more on the training of the handlers. But they were rewarded for their work, and a couple of kongs for play came as part of the standard equipment. The sniffer dogs were rewarded with a game of ball.

I don't think Jasper is really army material... :lol:
Jasper, lurcher, born December 2009
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Nettle
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Re: Animal Heroes

Post by Nettle »

Some do redirect onto the handler and other dogs. It's fairly commonplace.

There was also an incident not long ago where a police GSD redirected onto a member of the public and savaged his arm so badly that it will never be fully functional again.


They bite at huge pressure. The act releases floods of endorphins in the dog.

These dogs are there for a job, and once their job is over, they are not rehomable unless with a very experienced handler who has the facilities and lifestyle to manage them. Which is very seldom.

Certain breeds have been tried for this job and found wanting because although they'll go in, they don't let go, and it's essential that the dog does let go when told. Different agencies have different ways of training this, and my information here is out of date :wink: so I don't know what is the most usual method nowadays.
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minkee
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Re: Animal Heroes

Post by minkee »

I remember seeing the Police dogs' display at Crufts this year and it was really impressive. The dogs were positively trained and completely responsive to the commands. Obviously these are their 'best of the best' and also under very controlled circumstances, but it was fascinating.

There's about 3 different videos for this on youtube, and I don't know which is which, but I think this is the one I watched. It includes puppies in various stages of training

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=botP2gefZRU
JudyN
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Re: Animal Heroes

Post by JudyN »

I remember coming across a military uniform device so the dog's ball could be attached magnetically to the handler's jacket, so the reward could be given immediately. It's not as macho as having 101 weapons hanging off one's jacket and you can be pretty sure the military aren't using positive methods because they're soft pinko liberal bunny-hugging hippies - they do it because it has proven the most effective :D
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Nettle
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Re: Animal Heroes

Post by Nettle »

Very big difference between police dog, military dog and prison dog requirements. :wink: Only police dogs work closely among the general public and therefore have to behave best of the three.
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gwd
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Re: Animal Heroes

Post by gwd »

JudyN wrote:I remember coming across a military uniform device so the dog's ball could be attached magnetically to the handler's jacket,
this sentence made me laugh hard enough to make my dogs come over to investigate wtf was wrong with mom!

somehow i pictured one iron testicle. ........gain control of that one ball and the dog WILL pay attention to the handler!!!
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JudyN
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Re: Animal Heroes

Post by JudyN »

gwd wrote:
JudyN wrote:I remember coming across a military uniform device so the dog's ball could be attached magnetically to the handler's jacket,
this sentence made me laugh hard enough to make my dogs come over to investigate wtf was wrong with mom!

somehow i pictured one iron testicle. ........gain control of that one ball and the dog WILL pay attention to the handler!!!
:shock: :lol: :lol: :lol: Oh, the image, of the handler picking up his dog, attaching it to his jacket by his testicle, and walking off....
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gwd
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Re: Animal Heroes

Post by gwd »

JudyN wrote: :shock: :lol: :lol: :lol: Oh, the image, of the handler picking up his dog, attaching it to his jacket by his testicle, and walking off....
the dog would most assuredly follow. :lol:
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k9Queen
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Re: Animal Heroes

Post by k9Queen »

Every weapon maker gets bitten by their own work at one time or another.

I stumbled upon a video from an airshow where the K9 handlers were demonstrating an attack dog. The dog's ears were pinned back and he looked very anxious, but the service members were saying that the dog was happy and loved working. That dog was fearful. In my eyes, the use of dogs in the military or law enforcement is cruel and just as bad as thugs training and using dogs for fighting. They're expendable. A majority of them if not all attack dogs have to be euthanized once they are no longer useful to law enforcement agencies and the military because they are too dangerous to be placed in a home. What makes it more frustrating is how the guys in the video think it's hilarious that the dog is attacking someone. People watch these Demos and get themselves a Belgian Malinois to train for personal protection and bragging rights because they have an attack dog. Belgian Malinois' were originally hurding dogs, but they were ruined and now have a bad reputation. http://youtu.be/gS43GbP44XQ
Flyby
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Re: Animal Heroes

Post by Flyby »

There is a good program called Wardogs about the dogs recruited by the US military in WW2. The dogs were 'volunteered' for military service by their owners, and if the survived the war and could be de-programmed so they didn't attack people, they went back to the families they came from. The future was bleak for those who couldn't make the adjustments, but the majority could and did. In fact, the families had first claim on the dogs, and many GI's who'd grown very attached to their dogs had to let them go. A very small number were able to adopt their dogs, even if they'd been through hell together.
The war dogs got lots of stick (no pun) when introduced, but their 'nose, for the presence of the enemy saved many many lives, and of course made the dogs priority targets for snipers.
I also understand that Ridgebacks were once considered as army attack dogs, but their aggression once brought out was a genie which wouldn't get back in the bottle making them unsuitable for handling.
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